I just measured some speed and pro switches and the x axis thickness was between 1.26 and 1.28 mm. If their spec says they should be 1.3, they consistently run small. I can collect more measurements if needed, most of my builds have pros or speeds.
1 Like
Hm, another interesting observation, all the Novel x Kailh non box stems seem to be thicker than the non collaborations, from the small sample I have I am seeing they range form 1.27 to 1.30mm
Today I sent an email to PMK/SP to see if theyâve had any reports about stem inserts cracking due to box switch stems. Iâve also asked if they have any specifications they could share with us about their stem inserts. Hopefully they get back to me soon. Iâll share their response as soon as it comes in.
Iâve also linked this post to them so hopefully they can find time to look it over.
1 Like
I have got a workaround for the problem, if one has some loved box switches.
Just put a metal keycap a few times on the box switch, and the stem will be a little tighter.
I know it is not the ideal solution, but no need to throw away some good switches.
I used a cheap metal keycap which I got from ebay.
4 Likes
For those who havenât seen, Mike posted an update for this issue. Any pending purchases of box switches will be delayed but will be corrected at no cost. This includes Novelias and any Massdrop orders.
@lekashman do you know what will happen with the group buys that include switches from Input Club?
1 Like
I noticed the exact thing. However, couldnât take proper pictures due to poor lighting in my room. If you put the BOX Jades next to the Royal Trues, the fine stripe-layer is quite apparent. Also, I used SA Carbon keycap to try fitting and see if switches affected it.
To my surprise, Cherry MX Blue and BOX Jades required some force to push in the unused, new SA Carbon cap. After that, Royal True required a bit more force. But when I reversed the order, the same SA Carbon keycap slipped easily on MX Blue and BOX Jade switches. So yeah, even a couple of seconds on Hako Royal True widened the SA Carbon.
It would be great if you can post some before and after measurements of the Hako Royal True switches.
What do the letters and at the back of the switches signify?
Royal Trues have 1 at the bottom.
BOX Navy and Jade have 3 at the bottom.
Hey, thaâs a good idea. Thanks for sharing.
I wonder if any of you with calipers could try a mod like this to measure the results.
I would love to make use of all of these box switches I currently own 
Itâs something we are looking into now - we have had no issues with any of our products like the one shown so far - but I will sit down with Kaihua and ask about this topic.
3 Likes
I understand the viewpoint of @lekashman and @kailh , b/c it âseemsâ that box switches have been in the wild for a year with no issues. However, there is zero chance that the switches are not problematic.
The only reason youâve had âno issuesâ with any products like the one shown is b/c you failed to notice it. There are many reasons for that. I didnât notice that 20 or so of my GMK hyperfuse keycaps were cracked for nearly 1/2 a year. It wasnât until I moved them to another switch that I found out.
The switches crack keycaps. Itâs plain and simple. PBT keycaps seem to be mostly resistant to the cracking, which may be another reason why no one has noticed up until now.
At this point in the game, selling these switches as-is without a clear warning that using them on ABS keycaps (and specifically GMK keycaps) will possibly crack your keycaps would be unethical.
3 Likes
I donât know how difficult it would be with calipers, but has anyone tried measuring the part of the box switch that isnât raised? Might give a better idea for what the thickness would be after reverting to the â1.3mmâ tolerances (assuming the ridge is the result of them adding thickness per Dareuâs request)
Melissa from SP/PMK responded to me that their measurements are as follows:
MX Mount is: 0.217 x .159 x .047 ROUND CRUCIFORM, RECESSED .005 (measurements are in inches)
aka 5.512mm x 4.039mm x 11.938mm RECESSED 0.127mm.
Followup email:
âThe cruciform itself is 0.217 inches in diameter with the cross bars measuring 0.159 inches long and 0.047 inches thick - the 0.047 inches is where the issue would be with the Kailh switches.â
2 Likes
I had an Iris with gateron yellows, Commodore64 caps with 3d printed adapters.
The caps had wobble, but they stayed on just fine.
Build a new one with box blacks because they have less wobble, so with the adapters thatâs better.
Really used it for the first time yesterday after building it, keycaps were literally popping off during use.
Now obviously, these are 3d printed adapters so they arenât as strong as a regular keycap. But, knowing that there was 0 problem on the gat yellows and after just an hour of use on the box blacks they immediatly pop off, I donât need anymore proof. I have 2 boards with box blacks and gmk keycaps > cracks. Iris with the adapters thus not cracking but popping off. Iâm done with the switches sadly. For now my solution with the iris is some tape and see how that works. Luckily the adapters are replacable.
So weâre looking at 1.19mm or so then? Thatâs interesting considering most switches (even from different brands) are at least 1.25mm. Presumably thatâs because you need the stem to be a little thicker so that they friction fit. Hard to say then what the ideal size actually is.
Agree with @pixelpusher. Saying box switches have been out for year without any issues is not very convincing because it took a while for the switches to reach a certain level of market saturation to where a good amount of people were using them. Additionally, as itâs been pointed out, the problem can be hard to notice. The cracking is not something you would be in a position to discover on a daily basis. Ultimately, a few anecdotes of people reporting issues prompted EVERYONE to check their keycaps at the same time which is why this is all happening now. There are multiple factors and the measurements speak for themselves.
But I think at this point itâs more important about how this issue is dealt with going forward rather than trying to play the blame game. Letâs make sure new switches are manufactured so that this doesnât happen anymore. Letâs also make sure there is full disclosure to those buying the existing switches.
2 Likes
We now have people reporting in that XDA Keycaps have started to stretch and crash from BOX switches: https://www.reddit.com/r/MechanicalKeyboards/comments/93jwkq/psa_xda_caps_will_break_on_box_switches/
I have also heard that cheap keycaps should be having issues. (I have destroyed some from a old AJAZZ keyboard by putting the keycaps on BOX Jade switches.)
This is some sad news. I have both navies and jades for 3 builds, but will most likely go with something else now. Wonder if the ones with updated stems will be available in Europe too? I would even be okay with changing just the stems if that would be a possibility.
This weekend I will start measuring my GMK keycaps to find out GMKâs mean & median for their keycaps receptacle thickness as well as try to establish their level of tolerance.
I wish GMK would publicly release their stem receptacle measurements like PMK/SP has, but at this point all I can do is measure.
1 Like
Iâve sent today GMK about 40 Hako switches (which are one of the batches that has caused fractures on GMK keycaps), so theyâll have âpre-retooledâ box switches to compare with once the new ones are made.
3 Likes