Oh yeah don’t get me wrong, I had no issues with your post & kinds feel the same sentiment on it myself. Also @evangs has a honestly good point in his post IMO. I was just agreeing with @Laughmaster with them probably not going away anytime soon & expanding on some points as to why I think that is. I’m still very on the anti Durock side as it stands, but I am also a believer of giving second chances. So if they keep their nose clean, produce high quality switches, & keep working so well with the community. I’d be willing to give their switches a try. Plus like I said before I’m a sucker for black & gold/yellow colorways, LOL!
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I’ll go on record and say I wasn’t a big fan of the Van, but the people singling you out and not adding support for your boards is ridiculous.
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It was kinda funny the first time tbh like “lol these guys got beef” but now it just seems like a ridiculous grudge.
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So Nautilus Nightmares won’t fit on a MiniVan? Ah, I see, at least the 1.5u Enter is missing. Meh. And yes, this really looks like a boycott to me since—at least from my point of view—the MiniVan one of the best and most popular 40% keyboards.
So with having an IMHO worsening last-minute-change to the colors compared to the IC and with no MiniVan support, I’m thinking about cancelling my Nautilus Nightmare order…
Then again, I have some other 40% keyboards where this keycap set seems to fit, also colorwise: a gray Daisy HHKB and a brass JD40, both with 1.75u Enter key and overall 0.25u wider than the MiniVan. (I also have a KeyHive Nightmare 50% kit, but the case is orange and surely doesn’t fit to NN colorwise—even despite the name does fit. 
)
And most of my MiniVans already have their dedicated keycap set (Catalyst aluminium case with GMK Paperwork, black case with GMK SkIIdata) or I’m waiting for their planned keycap set (purple case gets SA Laser, white case gets KAT Milkshake)…
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They really screwed the pooch when it came to Nautilus Nightmares.
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I liked the old colors, I may have bought it even without minivan support but the last minute change to the more washed out colors is a hard no from me.
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Now it says JWK, who I’m still completely sure who they are, but I think they were involved with Durock or the T1s or something too?
The only semi-clear thing I’ve ever read about this particular subject is in the marshmallow GB thread. Maybe that’ll clear some things up for you?
I saw that too, but the pricing on these is outrageous anyways. $0.75 per switch is the “get them while their hot” price right now & after they meet MOQ they go up to over $1 per switch according to the sales page! To top it off they throw a passive aggressive dig at Zeal about pricing!? To quote from the page " Together with Zambumon and DailyClack, we’ve set out to find a switch that is not only as smooth as more well-known switches but also silent while making it more affordable at the same time." 
Think it’s gonna be a hard pass from me cause there is no way you can convince me these switches aren’t grossly overpriced & then for them to act like they’re doing the community a favor…
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JWK is a large manufacturer, they do sell their products to OEM sellers like Everglide, afaik Geekmaker, Durock, the Marshmallow makers etc. same as Outemu just buys from BSUN and sells under their own brand. They’re all OEM sellers. Same as Sony just resells someone elses memory chips.
Lol indeed. Primekb going to stock them soon btw
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Is there anyone who DOESN’T sling shit at Zeal?
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LOL really & the crazy thing is to me I think Zeal’s switches are the only ones that truly justify their pricing. If you consider all the leg work he put in with research, having custom molds made, figuring out what the smoothest plastic to use are, etc. & then successfully implementing that plan & improving on it over time. You really can’t look at Zeal like he’s grossly overpricing his products. Are they expensive, yes, does he make money on them, yes, but I truly believe Zeal is not gouging & the ultra high quality of his switches shows that.
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there is no way you can convince
23% sales tax, 19% income tax. vendors in the US don’t really have to deal with the tax overhead. you might have to consider that the price might balance out due to better priced international shipping of just $7-$9 for 90/120 switches. also other shops prices arent SET yet, they announced at their prices. they might stay at that, they might change.
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OK, that is a shitload of taxing so I’ll give you that & honestly do appreciate you clarifying. I realize I came off pretty dickheadish in my previous post & I apologize for jumping the gun with the hate. Although my next question would be why not try to work out a better way to sell these like passing them off to vendors in other countries that don’t get hit as hard taxwise & have a profit sharing contract with them? Cause with all that tax you really are not doing any favors to possible customers & could possibly get stuck with a bunch of switches if they don’t live up to the best ones out there.
passing them off to vendors
I am a vendor. I actually sell around $20k-50k worth of goods every day. Not keyboard related though.
also there is a limited 12% discount code which makes them equal to other sellers at 66 cents a pop.
what you need to understand is that there are ways to work around those taxes but there are also other risks. I offer cheap international shipping into every single country in the world, literally, for what is essentially a flatrate of $7-9 up to around $80 for 4kg (8lbs) which is equal to 2,000 switches, with this comes a risk of lost packages, cancellations, refunds, chargebacks, and so on. meaning I have to cover my ass in case of losses. if you’re a US vendor you don’t have to deal with greater international shipping risks, nor 23% import taxes, massive duty fees, sales tax, you can roll forward and stretch any sort of income tax, you can deduct pretty much everything and the dinner with your girlfriend. those are things vendors in other countries can’t. that doesn’t mean though I have to roll over and say fuck it, let’s move all business to the US. now what happens with the guy in Berlin who wants some too? $40 USPS flatrate pack, fully valued, means he pays another 19% import vat, maybe $10 duty fee… it is not always price gouging. and before you say, well lets get a vendor in the EU then, the price would most likely be even higher.
now as to get it while it’s hot, get it while they exist I’d say. this is going to be a one time run, once we hit MOQ we might let it run a bit longer, maybe we let it run a month long, but once they are produced that’s final. no more, next colorway. doesn’t mean you have to get them, you can get them from primekb, you can get them from any vendor that wants to sell them at any price because there is no limit nor restriction or limits or regulations who can make those by the manufacturer JWK or the OEM resellers like Durock or any other reseller like Everglide - I’m fairly sure Everglide will sell them soon too.
But if you want them yellow and black… you might want to get those, at a fair price considering our risk on the other side of the table.
go check out my instagram, there should be a discount code in my story that still has some charges left on it 
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Ok, makes sense so the higher pricing is coming mostly from your import pricing & making sure you are covered on lost packages, cancellations, etc. So I can fully understand protecting you ass. Don’t get me wrong I wasn’t saying you owe the community anything as being real about it, you guys did the leg work & brought the switches to life so you do have the right to charge what you feel is fit.
Although do you see my side & why I’d be very hesitant to pay top dollar for unproven switches that are most likely not gonna perform as good as the best linears out due to the housing material. I’m thinking smoothness & wobble wise these will probably feel very much like retooled Cherry silent blacks with a spring swap. Not bad at all, but far from top end smoothness. The colors are cool, but even at the $0.66 price it’s still a hard sell for what are most likely gonna be above average linears with cool colored housings.
unproven switches that are most likely not gonna perform as good as the best linears out due to the housing material
well, the non silent version fooled a few hundred people for a year into believing they have a 2-3x more expensive product… so not that unproven. there is a whole market for those switches because they have proven to be actually really good and cheap’er.
I mean, lets be realistic, this really happened and it was discovered by less than you can count on one hand and it took over a year.
now all they did is added rubber paddings around the side rails. we compared them, they are on par with the more expensive products. dailyclack is recording sound tests right now for it. so far they come without the other products loud spring ping, they have a softer upstroke (less noisy), and then it’s pretty much almost the same sound and feel. btw. this also comes back to the price. it’s custom springs, new mold for the rubber inlays etc. so the wholesale price is way higher than the usual non silent version.
you can always buy 90, resell later. thank god items in this hobby rarely lose value. either way, try them, see how you like em, write a review, do a sound test - this community loves to say I’m right and we like to watch them show us, or listen. maybe they’re worse, maybe they’re better, we think they’re equal. but at least then it would be a factual founded personal opinion with the piece of resistance in your hands to proof you’re right (or not) 
edit: eh, no good way of saying what I’m trying to say…
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I mean there is some truth to what you are saying about the stealios taking so long to be found out, but in my personal experience with them I had a batch of knock off Zealios from KBDfans & knew from day one something wasn’t right with them. Although I just chalked it up to a bad batch & set them to the side. Not trying to be a dick, but I honestly found them to be subpar compared to real Zealios/Tealios. Also you have to remember all the stealios (or at least the majority of them) came out of KBDfans & I’d venture a guess that most of them went to people who did not have previous experience with real Tealios/Zealios. So to me that would explain why it took so long to be discovered more than the fact that the switches were on par with Zeal’s products. Also these are using different materials for the housings which will affect feel & sound compared to the all clear housings.
All in all you have given some points that really make sense as to why the switches are priced how they are & gave me a much better insight on it. To the point I may order a batch to test. Although I am still dubious if they will live up to other high end silent linear switches. Thanks for talking it out with me man! 
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Little update on the price gauging situation:
alpaca silent are now listed as $0.7 also optics boards now lists IC as $0.7.
Like I said, wait till the prices are set.
With the 12% discount (check instagram “homerowco”), Seriko is now the cheapest switch of all 3 with the cheapest shipping.
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