Funky Frankenswitches

Lots of info, love it! Thanks for the reply, I realized I meant longer pole, not shorter pole - but that’s to be expected when you’re typing that up at 4 in the morning lol.

I have a handful of Gazzews stems that I’ve also been trying out - the silent tactile sounds and feels pretty great in the halo true housing.
I’ll probably end up picking some more up later as well as some of his blends.

I had a pretty similar worry about trimming the spring, it seems like a mod that would be fairly inconsistent and probably not very beneficial so I only did it with one of the springs and have it quarantined in it’s own ziplock bag.

I’ll update with any new results/findings and potential sound tests!

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Hey, kid…

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ooh nice! I can just barely see the cartoon-esque halo lighting around the bag :joy:

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Tried out halo stems with different housings today!
I tested what halo stems sound/felt like in:

  • T1 Housings
  • Gazzew’s Boba Housing
  • Zealios Housing

Here are the stems compared to each other:

As you can see, and as expected the stems vary a bit in length, so you’d expect that the housings might be designed differently for the given stem.

Here’s how the halo stem looks when bottomed out in each housing.

They ended up sounding pretty different! I should note that they all have 62g stock springs!

Final Thoughts
In terms of feel, they all have a similar bump however:
The T1 housing feels sharp and almost has a click to it, I can only assume that’s the pole hitting the bottom. If it’s pushed slowly, you can feel the smoothness of the post bump travel, but when used normally it almost gets lost in everything.

The Boba housing doesn’t have the same sharpness and there’s barely that clicking sound I described, it almost feels muted. I don’t want to say mushy, but it’s a smooth travel after the bump.

The Zealios housing is kind of in the middle, it’s a bit muted/mushy with a bit of the clicking noise but really seems to have the characteristics of both the previous housings.

I shared this process in realtime on the Switchmodders discord and probably going to make a post on the subreddit as well to get it all in one place. Let me know if anyone has any ideas or thoughts!

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Hmm, anyone have any suggestions for housing choices for my Phoenix stems?

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Here are some reviews of a couple of YOK Panda derivatives I have been testing: namely Holy Pandas (2 weights), and MX Brown Pandas. All lubed with 205g0.

This is an extension of what I am doing in this thread, but since these are frankenswitches, I am describing them here.

BROWN PANDAS

MX Brown stem, YOK Trash Panda housing, 60 gr YOK Trash Panda spring. 205g0.

I assembled these as a joke. They are referred to derisively on other forums. Not sure if I’ve ever heard of a build with them.

I put together a couple of these without lube. I was kind of pleasantly surprised by these, as they are very poppy, but not excessively so.

But they lack refinement. They’re tactile, but some of it is just present and wasted. And that tactility makes a kind of grinding noise when typing.

They also wobble, but it’s not terrible.

But it has potential. The Panda housing amplifies the MX Brown’s weak tactility. The 60 gr YOK spring is a good weight, very robust. So I sent some to a builder.

Lubing with 205g0 brings significant improvement. The sound becomes less grindy, more clacky, and deeper. The switch loses some of the excess tactility, but becomes smoother. It’s still way louder than something like Ergo Clears, however.

The tactility is different than with Holy Pandas. With my heavily-lubed HP samples, you can feel that Halo True stem. There’s a thick resistance, and it just kind of totally collapses from there. With Brown Pandas, the tactility is more granular, like you would expect from MX Browns. The HPs are more authoritative, the Brown Pandas are poppier.

Maybe the thing to do is use the POM Panda housings for these, as it is probably quieter. And the 60 gr YOK spring is a bit too much for the MX Brown stem. I would like to try 58 gr Spirit springs, once they become available in Canada. [55 gr feels too light for Browns, IMHO.] I don’t know what you would call an MX Brown POM Panda with Spirit springs, but it could be an interesting switch.

HOLY PANDAS

Halo True stems, YOK Trash Panda housings. 68 gr and 63.5 gr Spirit springs. Lubed with 205g0. Lubed fairly substantially, to round out the bump and create a “big Brown” feel.

There’s nothing I can tell you about these that you don’t already know. I have 2 with 68 gr Spirit springs, and 4 with 63.5 gr Spirit springs.

I don’t enjoy the 68 gr HPs, since I don’t enjoy the 68 gr Spirit springs. I only used them because 68 gr is a popular weight for them.

Some people say that 67-68 gr and higher give better tactility for the HPs, but it isn’t worth it to me. There’s greater force and resistance, yes. But the stiff 68 gr spring [the 68g Spirit is particularly stiff] takes over the switch, drawing away attention from its characteristics. At least to me. I frown when typing on 68 gr HPs, just as I do with 68 gr Ergo Clears and OUTEMU Skies.

The 63.5 gr HPs, though… Very nice. Like the 68s, these are lubed to soften the tactility somewhat, making them into “bigger Browns.” The spring weight is good. As others have noted, 63.5 is well-suited to the Pandas. It’s light, but doesn’t lose as much tactility as some other springs. As always, the HPs go well with GMK keycaps and metal enclosures.

The 63.5s are light and pleasant enough that I wonder what 65 gr TX HPs would be like. There is a catch in the upstroke on the 63.5 when released slowly, which almost disappears on the 68. But it’s there, if you are looking for it.

These 63.5 HPs kind of feel like what I would imagine the more tactile mechanical switches of old felt like. A larger tactile area, a more ‘two-stage’ process, from high-tactility to almost none. Loud clacking noise.

I will not be using these in a build, however. You all know how HPs bottom-out. I think it’s harsh. And the sound, while amusing, is way too loud. Maybe those POM Pandas are the way to go? I could never use this in a quiet room. In a noisy, air-conditioned room, these would be great. Maybe a factory-floor.

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Jumping in with my low res frankenswitch, it’s not much but it’s mine. Created after messing around during a lube session, probably my all time fave switch now and I can’t wait to make more:

Top: clear housing (new)
Bottom: milky housing (heavily used)
Stem: gat clear (heavily used)
Spring: 60g stainless (new)
Lube: 205g0
Film: Deskkeys White

Overall feel is very similar to most standard, lubed linears like a Cherry Black or Gat Yellow. This switch does feels significantly more refined and is a pleasure to type on. The 60g springs make it poppy but not too strenuous to type on and the sounds is very nice to my ears. Why not just go with a Gat Yellow and save time/money/finger cramps? It’s not about the destination but it’s how you get there.

I’ll say this, it’s an unexpected and unnecessarily expensive exercise but it improves the Gat Clear experience significantly. One that I had on one of my very first boards years and years ago so it’s nice to revisit it but in a very refined way.

One caveat though, the first batch I made of these used very heavily broken in stems and milky bases. They were desoldered from and old board I used daily for about 3 years. I’m sure that plays a role in their smoothness and overall feel, which I have to say is excellent. I’m going to try them again with new stock and see how it feels.

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Has anyone tried Everglide Jade / Zealio V1 stems in a T1 housing?

I put some Jade stems [and springs] in ordinary T1 housings, and it made an interesting switch.

It feels directly like a cross between a Jade and a T1. You can definitely feel the Jade stem [which is a different tactility than the T1], but also the T1 housing [which is much more tactile than the Everglide housing.]

The Everglide spring didn’t always co-operate, though, and sometimes I had to use the 65 gr T1 spring. But I think the Everglide spring is better for this switch.

This is all very interesting, because I thought Everglide housings might be the same as T1. Some people did comparisons, and one was even posted here:

However, I think the Jades are much less tactile than T1s, and Jade stem in T1 housings is more tactile than Jade stem in Everglide housing. So I doubt the two housings are identical.

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Interesting!

It’s possible that the plastic bits are the same for the housing while the contact leaves are different. A good portion of what a housing imparts on a switch comes from the leaf.

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Soo, I made me some Tiger Ink’s (Ink Yellow stem Ink Silent house + yellow switch films)
And after soldering (ofc) when I plug it in the keys start registering all over the place. :dizzy_face:
All it takes to activate is to wobble the stem…
But not all of them is like this. Can this be the infamous Lose Ink Leafs that interfere?

This is a new one for me - I’ve had leaves make sounds from being loose but I’ve not had phantom actuation all over the place. I don’t think loose leaves would cause this, as the stems are typically holding the contacts apart until pushed down. Very curious indeed. Without taking a magnifying glass to your board it’s hard to say what’s going on. Hard to imagine it’s the stems since you went linear --> linear but maybe the legs on the yellow stem are super mild vs how the silent’s leaves are set up?

Well, now that I’ve got to try them I would like to say I hate’em. It’s possible that I have created a 1mm speed switch, that together with Durock 55g springs and MT3 caps makes it not so fun.
I heard that the Psyko frankenswitch also breaks, can it be something like that?

I stumbled across Durock’s description of their Daybreak and Dolphin silent linears, and noticed it has a Polymer Nylon bottom housing versus Nylon PA found in their L series. Is it a stretch to assume their new bottom housings might make for a great H1 alternative?

[IC] H1 Linear Switch
Nylon PA vs Polymer Nylon

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Linear and tactile Everglide housings contain different leaves. The ones used to make Jades are the linear Everglide housings. I would like the Jade stem/T1 housing to be a stock offering though!

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This is my second commentary on a Frankenswitch. Again, it is an extension of what I am doing, discussing modded tactiles, in this thread.

Golden Skies

Frankenswitch:

OUTEMU Sky [Tao] Stem in TTC Gold Brown V2 Housing | and

OUTEMU Silent Sky / Silent Forest Stem in TTC Gold Brown V2 Housing


The switch I am discussing today comes in at least two major forms, the OUTEMU Sky stem in a TTC Gold Brown V2 housing, and also the Silent Sky stem in the same housing.

I hesitate to call it a frankenswitch, because the Sky / Silent Sky stems are designed to be incorporated into various housings. This simply makes them into Sky variants or a combination switch, rather than the kludge that is implied by the term ‘frankenswitch.’

The most successful, in my view, is the Silent Sky in the TTC housing, which I have labelled “Golden Sky.” The combination involving the regular Sky stem, which I describe later, was less successful, and more deserving of the ‘frankenswitch’ appellate.

So first, the [Silent] Golden Sky.

Construction:

The OUTEMU Silent Sky stems are advertised as being compatible with “Cherry MX class” housings, and this extends to the vast array of compatible switches. The Silent Sky stem itself was originally inspired by the feel of the “Ergo Clear,” being a switch of reasonable tactility having a lighter spring than stock MX Clears.

However, as some people have noted, the Sky and Silent Sky stems departed over time from their close resemblance to the MX Clear stem, and the bump profile is now different. Despite these changes, I would say that the tactile level or intensity of Skies and Silent Skies are comparable to that of Ergo Clears.

I have a testing keyboard with 65G Ergo Clears, and there is still a resemblance to them in the later, non-silent Skies. They both share a conventional Cherry-style mid-profile bump. The Silent Sky stem, however, is top-loaded. The tactile ‘bump’ is concentrated at the top of the keypress in the same manner as Zilents and Kailh BOX Browns and Pro Purples. It is sometimes described as a “P” profile bump, in that the distinct tactile event occurs right at the top, and is replaced afterwards by linear travel. This is unlike the “D” profile, a giant, constant bump, present in the new U4 stems. The moderate intensity of the bump is why I say that the Silent Sky stem’s tactile intensity is similar to Ergo Clears, as opposed to the heavier tactiles.


(OUTEMU Silent Sky stems can be purchased as a separate component)

The Silent Sky stems can be placed in nearly any housing, but it leads to different sensations. Inside an MX Brown housing lubed with 3203 and using lubed 55 gr Spirit springs, the switch is light, quiet, and not much more tactile than MX Brown. What is interesting about the TTC Gold Brown V2 housing used in the “Golden Sky” switch is that it successfully produces the desired characteristics of a “Silent Sky” switch while in a cheap housing that does not require lube.

It has been said that the cheaper the housing, the better OUTEMU Silent Sky stems will perform. This seems to be validated in the “Golden Sky” switches, which I purchased at $1.80 per 10. The stems are an easy fit, and gave me no trouble. The existing TTC spring is fairly robust, being designed to vigorously return a stem more tactile than MX Brown. I think it actuates around 50-55 gr, and bottoms-out around 60 gr. This makes it a kind of ‘slow curve’ tactile spring, I think.

The TTC springs are pingy and require donut lubing, at the very least. Note that the TTC springs are longer than most.

Switch-feel

Once assembled, you have a switch that is less ‘poppy’ than the TTC Gold Brown V2, and about as tactile. The travel feels shorter, as with most Silent Sky builds, since the bumpers seem to take up space during the keypress. It can feel mushy at first, you need to break the switch in and give it some time. It results in a tactile what a deep and quiet sound, and perfunctory tactile event and travel. It’s almost like a silent Pro Purple. Or, especially, the new BOX Silent Brown.

I felt that the stock TTC spring could be improved upon. It is fairly heavy in actuation, and doesn’t have much of a force curve. So I tried the switch again, using 60 gr TX springs. That’s a similar bottom-out weight, but probably lower in actuation than the stock spring.


(60 gr TX springs are a good weight for the (Silent) Golden Skies.)

With the 60 gr TX (donut lubed) springs, I felt as if the switch had improved. It is easier to actuate, and still has a springy return. It also feels as if the travel is somehow longer, closer to the full 4mm than the <3.6mm travel I perceived with the stock spring.

So, in my view, the Silent Sky + TTC Gold V2 housing, using a 60 G TX spring, is the best version of the switch. I would also like to try 58 G Spirit springs, should they become available. I found 55 gr Spirit springs to feel weak, even in a lubed MX Brown housing, so I think 58-60 G is a better weight here. In contrast to switch using the stock TTC spring, which felt shortened as in the BOX Silent Brown, the Golden Sky with 60 G TX spring feels more like a less-tactile, less-sharp Zilent.

The biggest hazard here is the spring lubing. The switch overall is fairly quiet, so spring ping and crunch is the noise you will hear if you are not careful.

Conclusion:

It is possible to make a quiet switch fairly cheaply if you have access to Silent Sky stems and cheap TTC Gold Brown V2 housings. The TTC housings don’t take well to lube, but the Silent Sky stems seem to function fine without any. It’s a simple ‘P’ shaped bump as you’d expect from the Silent Sky stems, and is not going to win any awards for tactility or unique feel.

The problem with these switches using stock springs is what seems to be a combination of a flatter force curve, and the perception of shorter travel. This is remedied by aftermarket 60 G springs. Still, it’s a switch that’s closer in feel to rubber-dome than mechanical. But it does work, and doesn’t come with any excesses. I’m very interested in the possibility of building a board with these quiet, moderate-tactility switches.


Alternate switch:
OUTEMU non-silent Sky [late model] stem in TTC Gold Brown V2 housing.

Tried three versions of this switch: stock parts, lubed, and lubed with 60 gr TX spring.

Description:

The stock TTC Gold Brown V2 is kinda a 'roided up MX Brown. More tactility, more spring, more smoothness. But not much more. Because of the higher tactility and weight, it wants to be an Ergo Clear.

Variant 1:

With the OUTEMU Sky tactile stem, and the stock TTC spring, this is a very poppy and energetic switch. It is not relaxed.

It kind of reminds me of an inflatable amusement ride.

Without lube or any other mods, there is noticeable wobble. It’s also noisy. It’s fun to type on, but I am not sure it would be great for sustained typing.

It also sounds crackly and rattly, like a higher-pitched Everglide Jade.

Variant 2:

With lube [205g0], the sound improves somewhat. It becomes lower pitched, which is helpful, since the stock parts make a chittery noise. However, the feel doesn’t improve, and might actually become kind of sluggish. I’ve heard the TTC Gold Brown V2 switches actually feel worse with lube, and this may be the case here.

Variant 3:

With lube [205g0] and a 60 gr TX spring, these switches feel more boring. They are flat, and the spring makes it feel relatively underpowered. I don’t recommend this spring. Since both the TTC Gold Brown V2 and especially the OUTEMU Sky want to be an Ergo Clear, it is best to use a more energetic spring, like the stock TTC spring.

VERDICT:

I think the Silent Sky stem in the TTC housing provided a better switch for typing. The regular Sky stem is energetic and poppy, and could be suited for some uses.

I recently saw someone asking about ‘bouncy’ switches that could be used in an MX-based calculator or numpad, and I recommended the stock Sky stem in the stock TTC housing/spring. Doesn’t even require lube, except for the spring. It’s going to be noisy, but it could suit that requirement.

If you’re putting a regular Sky stem in a Gold Brown V2 housing, just leave them stock. Same spring, no lube.

Otherwise, I’d rather use the Silent Golden Sky. The TTC housing is a fine basis for the Silent Sky stem. You just need to determine whether you want the resistance offered by the stock spring, or the lighter experience of 60 G TX.

I don’t intend to take credit for the switch, as they were being discussed publicly on Discord as an affordable silent switch.

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Ninja Turtle

  • Kiwi housing
  • YOK Panda spring
  • Gazzew silent linear stem
  • TX polycarb film & 3204 lube
  • 90’s green shell :turtle:
  • Steel-silver stem :crossed_swords:
  • Quiet like a ninja :mute:

Very quiet linear with a rad 'tude.


Flavor-text:

You can see what inspired the name and more photos in this thread.

These Kiwi housings are proving better homes for these stealthy stems than the YOK Pandas I had them in before - not that those were bad, but I think the tolerances are better for the stem here, leading to a bit more crisp feel.

Any switch with these stems is going to be very quiet, and of course these are no exception. The dampened bottom-out might be a turn-off for some, but the owner of these switches picked out these stems as an easy favorite because of it. The bottom-out feel is pretty unique, and definitely distinct from other silent linears I have tried.

Yes, that’s a POG slammer from the 90’s.

Now all I need is some pizza! :pizza:

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All I have to say is that they need blue, purple, red and orange switch-films for bandanas. :grin:

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Halo U4

  • Halo housing
  • Gazzew U4 silent tactile stem
  • 62g gold-plated spring from KBDfans
  • Very quiet
  • Strong tactility w/o harshness
  • “Complex” dampened feel

Flavor-text:

After having tried prototype “clear” U4 stems in Halo housings and finding them a little muddy and underwhelming, I didn’t expect much different from the white ones that came pre-assembled in the new Boba housings.

I love being wrong about these things.

What we have here is something that to my sensibilities, is altogether more mellow and pleasant than the Boba U4. While the Boba U4 is a study in tight tolerances and steroid-aggressive tactility somehow wrapped in very quiet package, the Halo U4 is a glimpse into novel, complex dampening. I’ll do my best to explain.

The weighting of this combination reaches a sort of “valley” just as the tactile bump ends, with the spring providing plenty of resistance against bottoming-out before reaching the already soft silicone pads. While some U4 combos I have tried make it practically unavoidable to slam right into those dampeners, this one makes it remarkably easy not to bottom-out even while retaining a fair amount of the U4’s strong bump profile.

The result is a switch that’s snappy yet soft; a bit like biting through a stick of chocolate that’s embedded in a big, pillow-y marshmallow.

If we’re talking letter-shaped bumps, this one’s a “P” - but in cursive. Resistance up-top that you push through and overcome to be met with a springy cushion right as the rounded bump ends. Pressing the switch lightly, it almost feels as if it has reduced travel - but if you push through that, there’s just a bit more travel before you hit the gummy-soft dampening pads on the bottom-out.

Another bonus of the updated U4 stem is a bit more stability than most other Halo housing combinations I’ve tried, albeit less than the all-but-perfect tolerances between these stems and Boba housings.

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Hey! I recently made these too!
It’s a crazy feeling switch.
Edit: also using prototype U4s, i did run into a small problem with the leaf but just had to be careful when closing the switch up

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Lorde

  • Silent Box Brown stem & upper housing
  • Box Royal spring & lower housing
  • Sharp, strong tactility
  • Dampened top & bottom-out
  • Subtle “click” synced with actuation / tactility
  • North-facing / GMK compatibility

The name was an obvious choice, because after this mod, they will never be Royals. eyyy


Flavor-text:

Anyway. The idea for these came from two different places. More generally, I’ve seen conversations musing about dampened clicky switches, and more specifically a friend of mine totally new to mechanicals has been trying switches and mentioned how much he loved the crisp kind of tactility that clicky switches had, but that the noise would drive him nuts.

While I’ve seen plenty of lamentation about the Box tactiles’ propensity for producing clicking sounds depending on their age / use / other factors, this switch brings it out as much as possible and relies on it as a less loud but still plenty audible alternative to discrete, purposeful noise-making mechanisms. Since the click itself is caused by overcoming the negative-style tactile bump of the slider, it’s naturally synced with both tactility and actuation.

The sound isn’t too different from that of a normal Box Royal, except there’s only the click of the leaf / pusher / slider-cam interaction - no bottom-out clack or top-out rattle. The click itself is a bit more sharp with the SBB stem vs the original Royal, as well.

These are some weird bois, but if you’ve been curious about dampened clickies, Lordes are an easy to reproduce take on the theme.

A side note - I’d originally intended to use Crystal Royal bottoms for this switch because they look great and have 5 pins, but found that those are closer to the more subtle Hako Royals than the bombastic Box Royals. While the combination was still a pleasant one, it was pretty unremarkable - basically a slightly heavier and more tactile Silent Box Brown.

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